Author Topic: Suite_01 (Withdrawn)  (Read 3884 times)

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RJB54

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Re: Suite_01
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2016, 08:21:56 PM »
HEY! finally!
I had some time to listen to the 1st piece.
A question: is it intentional that there is no pedal in the piano part? (until the very end, that is)

just so you know, that really really long held note in the violin at the end will have to be taken in multiple bows, so be prepared, if you don't have a very good violinist you will probably hear a slight change in direction when the bow changes. With a really good violinist this isn't an issue.  (and personally, I rather like the effect of a long note with free, uneven bowing. You hear this sort of thing in violin concertos often where you need a bit more bow speed to compete with the sound of the orchestra.)

Regarding the pedal, you and other pianists have said that unless you want a particular effect, to not overpedal, leave it up to the pianist and that's the approach I took here. I put the pedal at the end to emphasize that all of the chords should be left ringing.

Regarding the held violin note, I wouldn't especially care if there are multiple bows, in fact, in a part like that I would expect that there would be a change of bow on such a long note. If a given player makes the change of bow more noticeable than another, well thems the breaks in a live performance; one is always at the mercy of the abilities of the performer.
Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST.
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Michel.R.E

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Re: Suite_01
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2016, 09:13:42 PM »
regarding pedal: ok, I just wanted to be sure.
I was mostly basing it off the recording. Sometimes one might actually want no pedal at all, it's a rather dry effect (one I'm not fond of myself).
and yes it's best not to write in all the pedal work. like I always say: best to just include "con ped." as a score expression at the beginning.
"Writing music to be revolutionary is like cooking to be famous: Music’s main function is not revolution. – Alan Belkin "

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RJB54

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Re: Suite_01
« Reply #17 on: September 19, 2016, 09:28:11 PM »
OK, I'll add that at the beginning of the movement.
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Michel.R.E

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Re: Suite_01
« Reply #18 on: September 20, 2016, 10:52:33 AM »
Listening to the other 3 movements.

The 2nd one is a bit odd, as a direct follow-up to the 1st. It has a certain "Americana" feel to it, with that tinge of Hirajoshi modality.
A few of the double-stops may be a bit problematic, especially when you go from an interval larger than a 5th to one smaller than a 5th (discounting those with open strings where this isn't an issue).

I absolutely love the 3rd movement Waltz.
A few double-stops in this one MIGHT be problematic. I can't test them since your piece is for violin, and the stretch on a viola isn't quite the same.

For some reason, it (at least the beginning) reminds of this Sondheim piece:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aasECsxrSzQ
(no it doesn't sound like it, there's just a certain relationship in the "harsh" jazzy harmony)

Your final movement really makes me love what can be done with serialism.
I want to point out an example of what I mean about being careful about double-stops.
In the final movement, at measure 29, while it might look like you have an open string on beat 3, it would not be playable as an open string, because the lower note would have to be on the D string. There's an intervening string (the A string) between the two. So that double stop would be played on the D and A strings. In this case it's not particularly problematic, the interval isn't huge.
But earlier in your other movements there are some very wide intervals that have to be played on lower strings to be playable.

Anyways, GREAT suite, I really enjoyed it. particularly the last 2 movements.

I'm looking forward to what you do with that middle movement.
If I were you, I wouldn't worry about it being too dramatic. I think the material of the suite can handle it.

**

One minor quibble about some of the violin writing: it would be nice to have a few spots without violin in the preceding movements. It's playing a bit non-stop.
"Writing music to be revolutionary is like cooking to be famous: Music’s main function is not revolution. – Alan Belkin "

"Saying something new about something old is still saying something new. – Jamie Kowalski"

RJB54

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Re: Suite_01
« Reply #19 on: September 22, 2016, 05:50:44 AM »
Michel, as always thanks for your comments.

Yes, Mvt II is a little odd following what happens in Mvt I. That's why I added that little introduction as a mental transition between the sound-world of Mvt I to the sort-of rag in Mvt II.

Mvt II was the first movement I wrote; well, actually I had already made the decision to incorporate my Group Composition contribution and that that would be the last movement, but Mvt II was the first 'new' movement I wrote without a clear conception of the piece as a whole. After writing it I got the idea of the arch concept which lead to writing Mvt I as a slow counterpart to Mvt V and Mvt IV as a dancelike counterpart to Mvt II.

My thinking was/is that the missing Mvt III would (at least attempt to) bridge the disparate styles of the other movements by having a first theme in a syncopated, jazzy, style ala Mvt II, a second, more melodic, theme/style similar to Mvt IV with an interlude in the middle evoking Mvts I and V.

I must say that the Sondheim association is very pleasing to me as I consider him one of the best composers for American musical theater ever. I can hear what you mean, the surface style is not jazz but the complex chords have a feel that is similar to the complex harmonic patterns of bop and post-bop jazz.

I am going to do a rewrite of the entire suite (which will include Mvt III this time  ;D) and will take your other comments into consideration. Originally, I just wanted to write a simple, small, piece after spending so much time on my big, heavy, symphony; but, now that some time has passed and with the comments I've gotten, I think I will redo it in a slightly more substantial manner (including giving more of the spotlight to the piano than I have so far).
Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST.
Frank Zappa

RJB54

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Re: Suite_01 (Withdrawn)
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2019, 03:04:40 PM »
As noted in the OP, I am withdrawing this piece.
Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST.
Frank Zappa

Patrick O'Keefe

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Re: Suite_01 (Withdrawn)
« Reply #21 on: June 03, 2019, 09:17:38 PM »
I'm not exactly sure the significance of "withdrawing" is, but I'm glad you have not withdrawn it from the forum.  I just sampled the movements and definitely want to return to them and really listen.  Hopefully tomorrow.  I have not read the thread yet so don't know know what prompted you to withdraw the piece.  I think it certainly seems worth keeping.

RJB54

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Re: Suite_01 (Withdrawn)
« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2019, 03:27:29 AM »
It really was that while the individual movements are OK it just wouldn't come together as a whole composition. In fact, reflecting that, two of the movements have already been repurposed into my 3rd Violin Sonata.
Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST.
Frank Zappa

mjf1947

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Re: Suite_01 (Withdrawn)
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2019, 05:09:21 AM »
A tough decision to be sure .... but one with great optimism for future endeavors.

Keep up the wonderful compositions ............

Mark

RJB54

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Re: Suite_01 (Withdrawn)
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2019, 06:04:37 AM »
Thanks
Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST.
Frank Zappa