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Great start!   Lots of material to work with and a strong statement of its "sonic universe".
Works in Progress: Senior / Re: Three Conversations
« Last post by Patrick O'Keefe on Today at 12:51:06 PM »
I hear what I expect to be a dialogue, but it often sounds like a competition.

Interesting that you mention that.  I probably should mention that I struggle with names for compositions and any "programmatic" name inevitably is added after the composition.  After writing the original clarinet and piano pieces I pondered names that would imply an equal relationship between the two instruments.  I came up with "Dialogues" but knew it was misleading.  I briefly contemplated "Dialogs and Arguments"; these are equal partners, but they don't always cooperate.   Adding the 3rd instrument didn't change that.

I've made a few moe tweaks, but I think the pieces are basically complete now.
Thanks for the encouragement, Jer!   Finishing this movement is going to be a long journey.

Works in Progress: Senior / Re: Three Conversations
« Last post by Jerry Engelbach on Today at 10:31:40 AM »

OK.  I've updated the audio files with clarinet a bit more prominent.  I have hopefully not brought it too much forward.  I definitely do not want to give the impression this is a work for clarinet with piano and cello accompaniment.   


I don't think there's any danger of that.

You have brought out the clarinet more. But there are more places where you could do so, or cut back on the other instruments.

I hear what I expect to be a dialogue, but it often sounds like a competition. The instruments can trade back and forth more off the dominant position, depending on which has the main melody at the moment.

It's awfully good music. I think that the players just need to be more mindful of each other.

Following your order, I did enjoy.
It's great. Harmonically adventurous and aggressive. Keep going.
Advanced Composition / New Course for Composers by Alan Belkin
« Last post by Ron on Today at 07:19:43 AM »
I became intrigued by the Concerto Grosso style of music after seeing the work of Schnittke and our own Michel's efforts in that genre.

Schnittke used a harpsichord in his first C.G., which gives his work a Baroque flavor. Using his instrumentation, I decided to take a stab at writing a little something in the Concerto Grosso style. It will take a huge amount of effort to expand this fragment into a complete movement:




Works in Progress: Senior / Re: Three Conversations
« Last post by Patrick O'Keefe on Yesterday at 12:57:22 PM »
I have a feeling (not a misleading one, I hope) that section(s) A could benefit from a little tweaking to make them sound a bit less repetitive (from 4:00 to 4:30, for instance).
I've made a few changes to the A sections including deleting a couple measures in the 2nd one and making some minor tweaks in the 4:00 to 4:30 area.  (Actually, I made a lot of changes, but I undid most of them.)  I doubt the changes address much of the repetitiveness but they may have helped a bit.
Orchestration / Re: Natural and Artificial Harmonics on Violin
« Last post by Michel.R.E on January 17, 2019, 05:12:05 PM »
videos of the Ravel examples"

piano trio, last movement (with score)

"l'Enfant et les sortilèges" opening
Orchestration / Re: Natural and Artificial Harmonics on Violin
« Last post by Michel.R.E on January 17, 2019, 05:06:26 PM »
just to simplify things:

Violins: can do natural harmonics at the 8ve, and at the 4th (ie: touching the string lightly and playing at those positions)
any other natural harmonics ARE possible, but it always depends on your player. For orchestral writing, natural harmonics should be kept to touch-4th and 8ve.

Natural harmonics are all different, some sound at the 3rd (plus one or two octaves), at the 5th (same thing), at the octave and double octave, and at the 6th. these are NOT all readily available on the violin.

for an example of rather extreme natural harmonics use on the violin, check the opening of the finale of Ravel's piano trio.

artificial harmonics means you press a note and then lightly touch with another finger the 4th up from that note (so finger C, touch F). the sound is two octaves higher than written pitch.
One SOME instruments you can play a touch-5th (notably the cello). However, be aware this requires a complete shift of the left hand position so the thumb can be used to play the fingered note.

Violas: having a slightly thicker string seems to help with harmonics.
natural harmonics are a bit easier, and 4th, 5th and some 3rds are more readily playable on the viola, but don't make a habit of using 3rds (major 3rd sounds the 3rd 2 octaves above, minor 3rd sounds the 5th 2 and a half octaves higher).

Artificial harmonics on the viola should be restricted to touch-4th harmonics. String positions are too distant to reliably play a touch 5th. the inverted hand position that cellists use for touch-5th harmonics is not available to violists.

Cello: Thicker string, more natural harmonics available. touch 3rd (both), 4th, 5th, 6th, are all available as natural harmonics.
Artificial harmonics should be limited to touch-4th, or the rare touch-5th (change in hand position means giving the musicain time to change back and forth)

Contrabass: Thickest string also has the most colourful natural harmonics, and more choice. Intonation is guaranteed because the finger position is very clear. (the smaller the instrument, the less leeway you have to find that sweet spot where the harmonic sounds best)
Artificial harmonics are limited to touch-4th, and only in much higher string positions (ie: starting at the 7th of each string)

For the most brilliant example of a melody in natural harmonics on contrabass, listen to the opening measures of L'Enfant et les sortilèges, by Ravel. it consists of a sort of wandering figure in 2 oboes, and a solo melody all in harmonics for the contrabass. The effect is quite stunning.
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